Heartland Daily Podcast

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This is the Heartland Daily Podcast the other day, Donald Kendall, Deputy Director of the Socialism Research Center at the Heartland Institute was a guest on the nationally syndicated Charlie Kirk show.

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Charlie was shocked by the results of a new poll by the Hartland Institute and Rasmussen reports which we released in December that showed one in five American likely voters who voted by mail in the 2020 election committed some form or another of voter fraud.

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This is an excellent discussion of the findings of Heartland's poll.

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Have a listen.

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Ok.

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Joining us now is Donald Kendall, Deputy Director of the Heartland Institute Heartland Institute of course from Chicago, Illinois, the subs of Chicago on this now viral survey coming clean.

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One in five admits the 2020 election fraud fraud, Donald, thank you for joining the program.

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Tell us all about it.

0:58
But yes, so this poll that we did, we actually came up with this colleague and I came with this idea about a month ago and we just, you know, we thought all the stories about potential voter fraud and all of that mail in balloting the issues that are related to that.

1:13
We, we just thought, you know, what if we just asked people, what do, what if we just asked them whether or not they, they committed fraud?

1:19
Obviously, we wouldn't use the word fraud, but we'll just ask them if they did a series of things that would,,,, we would, should be fraudulent when it comes to mail and balloting.

1:28
And we thought maybe we'll get 3% maybe we'll get 5% that would admit this, right?

1:33
Because it's a poll people, you know, you get called on the phone, you ask if you did one thing or another, maybe you lie, something like that.

1:40
So maybe we get 5% of people that are gonna admit to this.

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And when we got the poll results back, we got the poll results back late on Friday and we were just blown away.

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We could not have imagined this in our wildest dreams again.

1:53
We were maybe, maybe 5%.

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But when it came back, it was one in five that it averaged out to be about 20% of people admitting to fraud when it came to the mail in balloting.

2:03
We couldn't believe it.

2:04
So we are so excited to kind of release the results and see what the response would be.

2:09
And,, yeah, it has gone.

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It has gone pretty viral.

2:13
President Trump says, quote, the most important poll released in the last 20 years came out yesterday stating that 20% of mail in ballots in the 2020 election were rigged or defective.

2:21
Well, that's not exactly what it was, but we'll go with it.

2:24
That means that you're, that the election was a giant scam.

2:27
You cannot have fair and honest election.

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As long as they're in mail in ballots, cheating will always be prevalent.

2:31
France and many other countries have stopped the madness.

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The Republican Party must do something.

2:35
Now, now I do want to hone in on this Donald, which is that when you do have tens of millions of ballots unregulated, it does open the opportunity for people to push the boundaries and to do things that are untoward, fraudulent or illegal, doesn't it?

2:52
Oh, absolutely.

2:53
Yeah.

2:53
And I, I've heard some people, it's, it's funny because you see the first rush of,, of people covering this story and they, they just report the findings of, of the report of the survey and say, wow, this is crazy, you know, 20%.

3:05
And then you see the second wave of kind of the, the left response to it and they're trying to dismiss it in a whole series of ways and maybe it's not as nefarious as you might as you might think, you know, oh, we've had mail in balloting before and all of this and it's never been an issue.

3:21
It's just like, I don't know where these people are coming from because the mail in balloting that we've had prior to COVID is radically different than the system that we had set up during the 2020 election where basically everybody was sent a ballot and everybody can vote that way.

3:35
So, no doubt that was just a recipe for disaster.

3:39
And I don't think anyone's ever asked these questions and found out that.

3:43
Yeah.

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20% of people admitting that.

3:45
Yeah, we didn't do this the way that you were supposed to.

3:48
So that was the system that we, that we opened ourselves up to.

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And, and of course, there was a lot of people's speculating about potential fraud.

3:55
And I think this is one of the first polls that really highlight the, the reality of that situation and then just, just educate our audience.

4:01
For example, if you fill out a ballot for another family member and, and if they're not deh II, I believe the law is, if they are not, let's just say,, you know, pretty,, like just say, have dementia, it's illegal, correct.

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The only way you could do that is if you're a specific,, if you like, so fill out a form with the county that you can do it for a specific person.

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For example, if your grandmother has Alzheimer's or something.

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Is that correct?

4:26
Yeah.

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Yeah.

4:27
Yeah, exactly.

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And, and that was kind of another thing.

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It was just like, well, maybe these are just,,, maybe these are just a wife and, and,, and their spouse just sitting down at the kitchen table and kind of filling it out together or something.

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Maybe, maybe,, you know, the, the, the husband is making dinner and his hands are dirty.

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It's just like it doesn't matter, that's all fraud and it would not be the case if you actually had to go to a ballot box and vote.

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Like how we've done for the history of this country.

4:54
You can't just bring your wife or husband into the ballot box with you.

4:57
So regardless of how you want to like twist this in any way to make it not seem as nefarious, it still boils down to fraud.

5:04
And the fact that is that these levels of fraud 20% and this is I think that the numbers on this are, are 40% or so of people say that they voted via mail in ballot during the 2020 election.

5:18
So 20% of that, we're talking about tens of millions of votes that were cast in an illegitimate way like that is enough to sway any election in any country.

5:29
So it's, it's really eye opening to see these results.

5:32
Yeah.

5:33
So the, but the other number that I think is really fascinating is like, OK, let's put, first of all, this is self reported.

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OK?

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That's what's so incredible.

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It's self acknowledged is OK.

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So let, yeah, let's say some of it, OK?

5:46
My hands are, you know, full of marinara sauce.

5:48
I don't think it's just ok, whatever, fine.

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, or, you know, we're, we're doing this collectively and you do that.

5:54
Ok.

5:54
That, that, that's not smoking gun stuff.

5:57
But he, here, here's the one that I, I think is important.

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17% of mail and voters said they cast a ballot in a state where they were no longer permanent residents.

6:07
Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

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Now, this one, let's put all this other aside.

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Now this is fraud.

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There is no gray area.

6:13
There is no, you know, mom had her hands full with the kids.

6:18
What is this?

6:19
17%?

6:20
People said they submitted fraudulent mail in ballots that is illegal and traceable.

6:26
Elaborate on that.

6:27
Right.

6:27
Yes.

6:28
Yeah.

6:28
And I won't name any names, but I know personally certain people that have done this, maybe not in this past election, but, you know, they move and maybe they're not registered in the current state.

6:38
So they think, oh, you know, the morality of this is fine.

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I'm just gonna cast a ballot in the state that I used to live in.

6:44
That's fraud.

6:45
And the other thing like, OK, so we had that one.

6:47
We had the somebody filled it out for you or you filled it out for somebody else.

6:51
So, none of these are necessarily like completely overlapping.

6:56
So the real number of this could be much higher than 20%.

7:00
you know, just somebody committing one of these levels of fraud.

7:04
And not only that, and as you kind of pointed out, when you're,, phrasing that question, this is people admitting to it.

7:10
So surely you can imagine somebody that,, you know, he gets a call from Rasmussen asking them these questions and they're like, you know what, maybe I shouldn't admit to this.

7:19
But can you imagine somebody that's just lying and saying that they did commit fraud?

7:24
I think that's probably a lot lesser on.

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And when you're,, well, it goes to show it goes, it goes to show they don't know, it's illegal.

7:30
That's what's amazing.

7:31
I mean, otherwise.

7:32
Exactly.

7:33
And that's how we phrase the questions.

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We, we just asked them, did you do this?

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You know, not saying that it's necessarily bad or fraudulent or anything?

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Just did you do this?

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We're just curious, you know.

7:43
So, so that's why people are a little more candid with their response.

7:46
So, 17% of mail in voters said they cast a ballot in a state where they were no longer permanent residents.

7:52
So, these are people that left the state and they still have access or they're visiting the state casually, like, build out what that is.

8:01
Exactly.

8:01
I mean, you said, you know, someone maybe in Illinois that does this, what is this archetype?

8:05
Somebody that recently moved their family and they're still getting ballots or they have two properties or a vacation home.

8:10
Is that correct?

8:12
Yeah.

8:12
Yeah, any, any one of those is definitely a case.

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I mean, even in some cases when you have just your mail forwarded from your past address and now it's coming to your,, current residence.

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So, I mean, there's, there's any, any number of scenarios like that.

8:26
But, yeah, that, I mean, you honed in on it.

8:27
, well, hold on.

8:29
That's, let's just, I got to interrupt before we get to the rest of this podcast.

8:35
I wanted to let you know about two fantastic live podcasts.

8:39
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8:41
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8:48
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9:04
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9:07
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9:08
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9:19
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9:20
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9:27
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9:29
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9:32
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9:47
Oh, yeah, we're also on rumble.

9:49
See you there.

9:52
So let's pretend that you're in the Maricopa County assessor.

9:55
You're trying to tell me there are very, there might be ballots that are postmarked that have a stamp of another state.

10:01
Well, I mean, I, I'm not entirely sure about that.

10:04
I'm just, it would just be an interesting thing to ask.

10:06
Right.

10:07
It would be like, is somebody sending in a ballot from L A?

10:10
It's very curious because I had just heard from a different colleague when we were talking about some of this, when the poll results came in that the, that the rejection rate of these mail in ballots was like less than a half a percent or something like that.

10:23
And I just wonder like how egregious must have those ballots been to been read, objected if you know all of these one in five were accepted.

10:31
So I don't know what the, you know what it kind of takes to have a ballot rejected, but it seems like it's a pretty high bar if I had to guess, especially in certain counties like you were saying, but we're told this is the most secure election in history.

10:45
What does your data tell us?

10:47
Exactly.

10:48
Yeah, I mean, that has been the narrative in fact, if, if you, especially after what happened with Trump and everything, if you even question, if you even question the legitimacy of this election and you are subject to being shadow banned or, or, you know, deplatformed or any number of things.

11:06
And, and this shows that very clearly that this election should be looked at very critically, especially when we're doing this mass mail in balloting, which has not been done before and to just assume that it was all great and everyone played by the rules.

11:20
I think it's just incredibly naive and just serves the agenda of maybe the, that, that took office.

11:27
So we've all been told that we shouldn't be looking under the, under the,, you know, under the hood of this election.

11:34
And I really think that this, this poll was one of the first ones that really did just pop open that hood and see what's going on in that engine.

11:41
And clearly it's not good.

11:43
And in some states it's getting even worse, right?

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It's getting even worse with the proliferation of mail in ballots among all voters, male and persons.

11:52
11% said a family member, friend or coworker other acquaintance and many of them they feel that about on behalf of another person.

11:58
So 11% of people know other people that are cheating.

12:01
So this is just like a massive fraudulent exercise, isn't it?

12:05
Yeah.

12:06
No, absolutely.

12:07
And I really wonder,, I, I think Trump mentioned this in one of his posts about this that it's like, you know, the, the, the Republicans have to do something about it.

12:15
And obviously this kind of starts at the state level to kind of clean up your election rules when it comes to your state.

12:21
We're out of the, the, the pandemic, right?

12:24
The COVID mass hysteria is over.

12:27
Let's go back to voting how we normally do.

12:30
that I think that is the, the clear take away from this.

12:34
Donald.

12:34
Stay right there.

12:35
I want to talk to you after the break, by the way, it would be probably helpful for people to run P SAS saying, hey, if you're filling out a ballot that is illegal and you might be prosecuted.

12:44
OK.

12:45
What have we not covered here?

12:47
that you think or have, do you think we've covered all the numbers here?

12:50
Big takeaways.

12:51
We only have a couple of minutes, your thoughts.

12:54
Yeah.

12:54
No, I think we covered most of the, the numbers and of course, if you wanna see, you know more information on it, you go to heartland.org, you'll find it right on the front of the page there.

13:04
But I actually have a question for you on this Charlie cause I, I was wondering about especially considering just the outrageous numbers.

13:10
Do you think that this goes to,, this could potentially, like, exonerate Trump in any way?

13:16
And some of the charges that he's facing when it comes to like election fraud denial?

13:20
Yeah, I mean, the, the charges are not necessarily on, I mean, it's, we have yet to see.

13:26
I mean, I think this is big enough where this should create a mass movement to fix mail in ballots once and for all, it's not going to because what, what they do is they create rationalization campaigns by saying that Donald Trump is Hitler.

13:41
And if everyone gets, you know, it's my dirty little secret that I got sent in three ballots and I filled all three in.

13:47
Right.

13:48
It's my dirty little secret that my grandmother who is now blind or 95 years old and she tells me to go vote for Trump and I fill out Biden, right?

13:57
You know, something like that.

13:59
And by the way, granny farming is not a term I like, but the New York Times used it.

14:04
OK.

14:04
The New York Times had it as a term 10 years ago which young activists would go to nursing homes or old people's homes and scoop up ballots and fraudulently forge the wi their will and their intent.

14:18
So this is a major, but this would not be a problem if we had voting the way it used to be and, and they don't want it to be that way.

14:25
Exactly.

14:26
Yeah.

14:26
Yeah.

14:26
I think it's almost like, you know, and you're joking about the idea of voter suppression of just warning people about the rules associated with it.

14:35
Right.

14:36
I know.

14:37
But that, that could you imagine, you know, politicians coming out now and saying, you know what, maybe this mail and balloting thing, we don't need to do it anymore.

14:45
Like that's gonna rain down the same calls of so-called voter suppression.

14:49
So, I, I think the longer you wait, in fact, I think the worse that those calls will be.

14:53
So, I mean, to kind of quote Trump, it's like now would be the time to do something about this.

14:59
You can't wait any longer if you want to reel in mail in balloting now is the time.

15:03
Yeah, I guess my question would be, it would be for a lawyer.

15:06
Do you think that this poll is evidence enough to start filing lawsuits to say that, hey, that, that the will of the people are being thwarted or that there's, I mean, if, if you have one out of five ballots being fraudulently self acknowledged, you know, self admission that it's being fraudulently filled out, wouldn't that be enough for some sort of a civil challenge?

15:27
Maybe?

15:28
I don't know.

15:28
I'm not a lawyer, so I, I'm not a lawyer either.

15:31
But, hey, you know what,, throw something against the wall and see what sticks.

15:34
And in fact, some of the responses that I've seen from the left, they are trying to like dismiss some of the things that were some of the findings in this poll.

15:41
My gut reaction is like, then conduct a different poll.

15:45
See if your poll is going to find a lower number than because I'll challenge, I'll challenge all of those people to see if your results come back and it shows a much lower percentage.

15:55
And then I wonder what's a low enough percentage where this doesn't become an issue.

15:59
Obviously, 20% is like headline grabbing stuff.

16:03
But are they content with 10% and put all the other numbers aside, we have 17% of mail in votes according to you guys where they don't even live where they're voting, right?

16:14
It's unbelievable.

16:15
So, I mean, you have people voting for governors that aren't their governor.

16:19
I just want everyone to understand that.

16:21
So let's, let's, let's round down.

16:23
Ok, let's round down.

16:24
So in Arizona, there's roughly about 5,000,006 million ballots cast.

16:32
I think it's like 4.6 million.

16:33
Ok.

16:33
So 70% of people vote by mail in Arizona.

16:36
All right.

16:37
So that's 2.6 million, 2.7 million.

16:41
I'm just approximating.

16:42
Ok.

16:43
So let's say it's 10% that means 270,000 people vote and they don't even live in the state that could determine the future of the Republic.

16:51
That's according to your data.

16:52
I'm ring down, I'm rounding down by the way, by seven points.

16:56
Yeah.

16:56
Yeah, we were actually, we were actually discussing in the office yesterday, the idea of doing some like analysis of all of the results that we come in and kind of extrapolating, admittedly, it'd be a little bit of a kind of a back of the envelope sort of extrapolating this data across the state and see what the real kind of election outcomes would be if all of these fraudulent mail in ballots were discarded.

17:18
And I I my hypothesis is that the that election map, the electoral map at the end of the day would look very different of what the final one was on election day in 2020.

17:30
Great.

17:30
Thank you so much, Donald.

17:31
Great work.

17:32
Appreciate it.

17:32
Thanks so much.

17:34
Thank you for having me email us freedom at Charlie kirk.com and subscribe to our podcast, A Pro Hamas Mob, by the way, has just shut down the 110 freeway in Los Angeles.

17:43
It's just these people are unbelievable.

17:46
Thanks so much for listening.

17:47
Everybody email us as always freedom at Charlie kirk.com.

17:49
Thanks so much for listening and God bless.